For Piper is way, way, way, way off

I am a novice at bible translation, but even I know that a ‘literal translation’ is not exactly literal. I wonder if the ESV uses all the ‘O’s’ in the text? Or the ‘the’s’ as in ‘the God, the Christ’ when it is rarely translated in our English bibles.

Let me clear this  up -- I have little to no problem with John Piper or the ESV (not my preferred translation), just the method of discourse that he is using (as late as 16 August 2009) in promoting the ESV.

And from this post:

If “essentially literal” means anything it means keeping as much as possible the structure and wording of the original. Which leads me to ask the question why not an interlinear. Contrast a verse pair I choose to have as few complexities as possible:

And came out the Pharisees and they began to argue with him, seeking from him a sign from heaven, trying him. And having sighed deeply in the spirit of him he says, why does seek this generation a sign? Truly I say to you, in no way will be given to this generation a sign. (Mark 8:11-12 Brown and Comfort).

11 The Pharisees came and began to argue with him, seeking from him a sign from heaven to test him. 12 And he sighed deeply in his spirit and said, “Why does this generation seek a sign? Truly, I say to you, no sign will be given to this generation.” (Mark 8:11-12 ESV)

And, from here:

Oh my, I wonder what Piper will do with that?

HT

Posted on September 5, 2009 at 8:26 pm by Joel · Permalink
In: ESV, NIV, TNIV · Tagged with: , , , , ,
  • http://www.thechurchofjesuschrist.us/ Polycarp

    For some reason, a ping from http://goddidntsaythat.com/2009/09/06/on-literal-translations-a-quick-note/  went directly to Spam. Sorry.

  • http://www.thechurchofjesuschrist.us Polycarp

    For some reason, a ping from http://goddidntsaythat.com/2009/09/06/on-literal-translations-a-quick-note/  went directly to Spam. Sorry.

  • http://www.GodDidntSayThat.com/ Joel H.

    Earlier this week,  I posted about how translations deal with nearly parallel text.  I just added the ESV to my comparison.  Unfortunately, as with other translations, the ESV has identical English where the Greek is different.  (The impetus for the comparison was John Hobbins’ excellent analysis of the importance of minor differences in the texts.  I wondered if any translations made it possible to follow along without knowing Greek.  So far I haven’t found any.)

  • http://www.GodDidntSayThat.com Joel H.

    Earlier this week,  I posted about how translations deal with nearly parallel text.  I just added the ESV to my comparison.  Unfortunately, as with other translations, the ESV has identical English where the Greek is different.  (The impetus for the comparison was John Hobbins’ excellent analysis of the importance of minor differences in the texts.  I wondered if any translations made it possible to follow along without knowing Greek.  So far I haven’t found any.)

  • http://jenniferbecker-landsberger.blogspot.com/ Jennifer Landsberger

    Thank you, thank you, thank you.  I love it when someone else realizes/admits/ states that sometimes the translations are not 100% literal.  (and that there are translation errors & differences between different versions)!

  • http://jenniferbecker-landsberger.blogspot.com/ Jennifer Landsberger

    Thank you, thank you, thank you.  I love it when someone else realizes/admits/ states that sometimes the translations are not 100% literal.  (and that there are translation errors & differences between different versions)!

  • http://www.thechurchofjesuschrist.us/ Polycarp

    Not a problem, Jennifer. I have my translation preference, but I wouldn’t disparage other honest ones to secure an onlyist place for it.

  • http://www.thechurchofjesuschrist.us Polycarp

    Not a problem, Jennifer. I have my translation preference, but I wouldn’t disparage other honest ones to secure an onlyist place for it.

  • http://www.scripturezealot.com/ Scripture Zealot

    Bitsy posted on this too and I commented there.
    Jeff

  • http://www.scripturezealot.com Scripture Zealot

    Bitsy posted on this too and I commented there.
    Jeff

  • http://ancienthebrewpoetry.typepad.com/ John Hobbins

    Joel,
    Great questions. More literal translations like NASB and ESV preserve differences more regularly than less literal translations. Also, check out the new ISV.
     

  • http://ancienthebrewpoetry.typepad.com John Hobbins

    Joel,
    Great questions. More literal translations like NASB and ESV preserve differences more regularly than less literal translations. Also, check out the new ISV.
     

  • http://www.thechurchofjesuschrist.us/ Polycarp

    Thanks, John. For some reason, I have never really liked the ESV – nothing wrong with the translation, nothing sinister or evil – just that it has a committee feel. But, on the same side, I do use the NASB for literalness. For my daily talks with my children, etc… I use the NLT

  • http://www.thechurchofjesuschrist.us Polycarp

    Thanks, John. For some reason, I have never really liked the ESV – nothing wrong with the translation, nothing sinister or evil – just that it has a committee feel. But, on the same side, I do use the NASB for literalness. For my daily talks with my children, etc… I use the NLT

  • http://ancienthebrewpoetry.typepad.com/ John Hobbins

    The ESV is mostly the RSV. Since I grew up with the RSV, it has a familiar ring to me. But I prefer, as you know, to go back to the originals. Ad fontes, as the Reformers said.

  • http://ancienthebrewpoetry.typepad.com John Hobbins

    The ESV is mostly the RSV. Since I grew up with the RSV, it has a familiar ring to me. But I prefer, as you know, to go back to the originals. Ad fontes, as the Reformers said.

  • http://www.thechurchofjesuschrist.us/ Polycarp

    See, I like the RSV a great deal myself – which is odd since the ESV only changes it minimally – but you are right, the originals must be the source.

  • http://www.thechurchofjesuschrist.us Polycarp

    See, I like the RSV a great deal myself – which is odd since the ESV only changes it minimally – but you are right, the originals must be the source.

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